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mrbassie
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So is naib a privilged white male?
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Naib
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

richk449 wrote:

What is the relevant of your question? Naib went out of his way to insult noyb. It wasn't an accidental mistake. If it had been an accident, Naib would have quickly apologized for making the mistake, and everyone would have moved on.

Is there really a big problem with trying to figure out if it is okay to insult someone? When you show up to work, do you struggle with whether or not you should say "hey dickhead" to random people that walk by you in the hallway? I doubt it.

so just so we are all clear... when no prefered pronoun was stated and then to refer to them using a broad selection (again due to no preference stated) this was then taken as offense and then compared to being punched/slapped in the face while the individual has been using a term that is being use as a slur

just so we are all on the same page... and you wonder why this choosing to take offense is just hilarious :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
absolutely nothing there and you and noyb took the interpretation of offence :lol: :lol: :lol: you chose to take offense

while simultaneously throwing around "gaslighting" ... now go back and who is gaslighting whom trying to state that terf isn't an offensive term, trying to state I was mocking a pronoun when AGAIN, no prefered pronoun was stated. Remember it was noyb that took this down the route of offensive when they started using derogatory terms. Go check the timeline about what came first, its all logged here

mrbassie wrote:
So is naib a privilged white male?

I wouldn't really call my upbringing anywhere close to privileged but whatever floats your boat :wink:
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
richk449 wrote:

What is the relevant of your question? Naib went out of his way to insult noyb. It wasn't an accidental mistake. If it had been an accident, Naib would have quickly apologized for making the mistake, and everyone would have moved on.

Is there really a big problem with trying to figure out if it is okay to insult someone? When you show up to work, do you struggle with whether or not you should say "hey dickhead" to random people that walk by you in the hallway? I doubt it.

so just so we are all clear... when no prefered pronoun was stated and then to refer to them using a broad selection (again due to no preference stated) this was then taken as offense and then compared to being punched/slapped in the face while the individual has been using a term that is being use as a slur

just so we are all on the same page... and you wonder why this choosing to take offense is just hilarious :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
absolutely nothing there and you and noyb took the interpretation of offence :lol: :lol: :lol: you chose to take offense

Honestly, there is not much here. I am saying you are not being nice. You keep replying with "you are choosing to take offense". Which is both wrong (I am not taking offense*) and irrelevant (so what if I was taking offense - it has no impact on the question of whether you are being nice or not).

* Maybe it would help if you defined "taking offense". Is anyone who replies to your post with anything other than a virtual high-five "taking offense"? If so, then I guess the root of the problem is semantic.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

you are implying I went out of my way to insult noyb. Noyb is pushing I did it to offend YET... not once was the preferred pronoun stated... use the wrong pronoun "IM OFFENDED", use a list "IM OFFENDED"
dear god do you see how petty that is. reduce this and it is the response of those that want to be offended and thus the explicit act is moot.

so you and noyb need to stop looking to be offended. Remember, the only one that has used an offensive term is Noyb and then tried to gaslight their way out of it.. and I quote
noyb wrote:

TERF = Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminists (a term they proudly created to define themselves,

so what... it is now used as an slur against such a group and thus the usage is a form of offense. To try to gaslight by pulling up where it originally came from and ignoring how it is used is just distractionary tactics from the one persons that was using the offensive term
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrbassie wrote:
So is naib a privilged white male?
You can post as conservative white male despite your thoughts are all about the bottom hole you not have but that dick carrying a clumsy sack. This is your privilege in this forum whatever your skin color, sex and bank account really is!
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2020 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry for writing this: but! Fuck you for this 'white' this or that.

I don't give flying fuck about 'white' or 'yellow or anything else. Only about my nation. And there is difference between European 'white' nations. I don't care if my national comrades are straight, faggots, transgender, as long as we share the same two millenial genes.

And you middle-Europeans say that it's impossible. No it isn't. Some of us 'eastern' Europeans never were involved in Roman Empire experience and our genepool survived and stayed the same for two-fucking-millenias.

If username noyb was my national comrade, I would not care for any of these politics or gender differentiations or identifications and I would protect her/him to last drop of my blood.

Maybe it is different for you Northern Americans (U.S. of America is an state based on European immigration), but when you forefathers have been subjected to slavery, war foddery and downright genocide, you start to appreciate your origin.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh yes, it was also noyb that brought race I to this. What a nice tolerant progressive individual
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
Oh yes, it was also noyb that brought race I to this. What a nice tolerant progressive individual
Noyb is a conservative woman in her role in society
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mrbassie
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2020 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ulenrich wrote:
mrbassie wrote:
So is naib a privilged white male?
You can post as conservative white male despite your thoughts are all about the bottom hole you not have but that dick carrying a clumsy sack. This is your privilege in this forum whatever your skin color, sex and bank account really is!


You might want to change the batteries in your sarcasm detector.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2020 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrbassie wrote:
ulenrich wrote:
mrbassie wrote:
So is naib a privilged white male?
You can post as conservative white male despite your thoughts are all about the bottom hole you not have but that dick carrying a clumsy sack. This is your privilege in this forum whatever your skin color, sex and bank account really is!


You might want to change the batteries in your sarcasm detector.

Yeah, but without any sarcasm I want to emphazise that conservative young men have their issues with sexual orientation very often. We old men notice.
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mrbassie
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2020 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ulenrich wrote:
mrbassie wrote:
ulenrich wrote:
mrbassie wrote:
So is naib a privilged white male?
You can post as conservative white male despite your thoughts are all about the bottom hole you not have but that dick carrying a clumsy sack. This is your privilege in this forum whatever your skin color, sex and bank account really is!


You might want to change the batteries in your sarcasm detector.

Yeah, but without any sarcasm I want to emphazise that conservative young men have their issues with sexual orientation very often. We old men notice.


I bet you do ducky.
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o'bogamol
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@noyb, if you're still reading this thread, I wanted to take the time to let you know how much I appreciate the time you spend patiently explaining your position and experience. As a more or less conservative person, and a religious one, you challenge my assumptions.

As a christian who believes that all people are created by God, how can I view you as anything other than my sibling. And if I view transsexualism as wrong, yet, still how can I judge anyone when I have faults of my own.

If I am unsure how to handle 'gendering' from a religious point of view, then I think that I should err on the side of accepting a person as a sibling rather than worrying about whether my own action of gendering a person by their apparent birth gender vs identity is somehow incorrect. It seems that whatever approach allows me to show the most love towards a sibling in Christ is more important than worrying if using a preferred non-cis pronoun is 'being an enabler' Ultimately, it is more important to me that a person feel welcomed by me and my family than it is for me to be 'correct according to doctrine' but make that person feel unwelcome.

Thank you.

I hope one day we can meet and I hope that I show you the best welcoming that I can, damn the specifics.

Til we meet in person, see ya later sis.
:)
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

o'bogamol wrote:
If I am unsure how to handle .. from a religious point of view

Inquisition works for me. And I mean the First [Lite] Edition, not the one that began on October 1917 in Russia.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, there Grand Inquisitor Torquemada.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the sarkasm of tinea_pedis (inquisition) is too inexpensive an answer.
Thanks @o'bogamol for the religious perspective with questions.
o'bogamol wrote:
@noyb, if you're still reading this thread, I wanted to take the time to let you know how much I appreciate the time you spend patiently explaining your position and experience. As a more or less conservative person, and a religious one, you challenge my assumptions.

As a christian who believes that all people are created by God, how can I view you as anything other than my sibling. And if I view transsexualism as wrong, yet, still how can I judge anyone when I have faults of my own.

If I am unsure how to handle 'gendering' from a religious point of view, then I think that I should err on the side of accepting a person as a sibling rather than worrying about whether my own action of gendering a person by their apparent birth gender vs identity is somehow incorrect. It seems that whatever approach allows me to show the most love towards a sibling in Christ is more important than worrying if using a preferred non-cis pronoun is 'being an enabler' Ultimately, it is more important to me that a person feel welcomed by me and my family than it is for me to be 'correct according to doctrine' but make that person feel unwelcome.

Thank you.
...
(I embolded the parts)
If something is wrong with trans people, now what does religion say is best: In the most simple answer we think of Adam and Eve. They were created
- to love each other and
- get children and
- work (after paradise)

Yeah, but throughout thousands of years there were the soldiers, submerged in hate and blood, they lived a shortened life without love and children very often.

A not so long a period of time, but for more than thousand years, there were monks. These had the love (with christ and god) and work but not the children.

@o'bogamol, like in english law you could search for precedent and find examples in history how the special case was handled then. Additionally you can find many special cases in history, for example the castrates singing italian opera in the Vatikan. But perhaps the religiously motivated love you'd shown towards noyb with empathy is enough an answer.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2020 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Regarding Grand Inquisitor Torquemada, I think the Inquisition scene in History of the World, Part 1, is one of the most pointed and convicting criticisms of the horror of religious dogmatic thinking ever put to film. It nails the whole idea of the inquisition and points out the absurdity of inquisition thinking coming from an instruction of Christ-like love.

If you're interested, a book I am currently reading about the topic is People to be Loved: Why Homosexuality is Not Just an Issue by Preston Sprinkle.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2020 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A take against taking hormons:
Abigail Shrier wrote:
Until just a few years ago, gender dysphoria—severe discomfort in one’s biological sex—was vanishingly rare. It was typically found in less than .01 percent of the population, emerged in early childhood, and afflicted males almost exclusively.

But today whole groups of female friends in colleges, high schools, and even middle schools across the country are coming out as “transgender.” These are girls who had never experienced any discomfort in their biological sex until they heard a coming-out story from a speaker at a school assembly or discovered the internet community of trans “influencers.”

Unsuspecting parents are awakening to find their daughters in thrall to hip trans YouTube stars and “gender-affirming” educators and therapists who push life-changing interventions on young girls—including medically unnecessary double mastectomies and puberty blockers that can cause permanent infertility.
Shrier talks with Joe Rogan
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2020 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Should have been allowed to physically mature

https://news.sky.com/story/i-should-have-been-told-to-wait-woman-treated-with-hormone-blockers-to-reassign-gender-as-a-teenager-takes-nhs-to-court-12031191

Quote:

I should have been told to wait': Woman treated with hormone blockers to reassign gender as a teenager takes NHS to court

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Naib, yes
hormone treatment of children for the wrong reason is a violence like genital mutilation. In eastern Germany (GDR) athletes got these over long periods with devastating effects. Just for the pride the communist party state could take in olymic competitions. It is horrifying to read the reports how this effects their lives forever.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2020 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Children are old and wise enough to decide what sex they want to be, or what sex mommy and daddy encourage them to be. They are not, however old enough to jack uncle Randy's penis, because that would be against God.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2020 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

/thread
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:

while simultaneously throwing around "gaslighting" ... now go back and who is gaslighting whom trying to state that terf isn't an offensive term, trying to state I was mocking a pronoun when AGAIN, no prefered pronoun was stated. Remember it was noyb that took this down the route of offensive when they started using derogatory terms. Go check the timeline about what came first, its all logged here


So, obviously, I've been gone for a while... I needed to take a break because my girlfriend left me after 18 months, when she finally told her mom she's dating a woman (she's officially bi, but her mom refuses to tolerate her dating anyone other than a man, even though she's only sexually attracted to men, rather than being emotionally attracted to them, so she can't have a serious relationship with one - things had progressed enough that she didn't want to keep me a secret any longer).

TERFs proudly named themselves Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminists... they were radfems that were upset that trans people were bringing their "male privilege" (trans guys don't exist and are just deluded women seduced into wanting to be more like a man by their own internalized misogyny and the patriarchy) to the table, silencing the needs and concerns of "real" women, and, in particular, they believe that our goal is to invade female only spaces so that we can rape them (which is why I had my penis removed, so make me... more rapey?). In the end, TERFs believe that you are the genitals you were born with and you can never be anything more than that. They're one step away from saying that, if you were born with a uterus and have XX chromosomes, you belong barefoot in the kitchen, while everyone else is a man... and that is why TERF became a slur. It's like a Klan member suddenly crying foul that people consider them racists - the veneer on their supremacist views is so thin in either case, that you can see right through it.

Naib wrote:

Oh yes, it was also noyb that brought race I to this. What a nice tolerant progressive individual


By pointing out that trans women of color are the most likely to be killed? How horrible of me... and it's amusing that you think I'm a progressive... I'm a libertarian that believes that as long as you aren't hurting anyone, you have the right to do anything you want. I'm actually pretty conservative in my personal life - I believe abortion is murder (on science grounds! I'm an atheist), I don't do casual sex, I'm monogamous, I believe you have a right to exercise your religion and I'm capable of being silent for a moment if you want to say a prayer before a government meeting, I organized and spoke at a half dozen Tea Party events, etc. Overall, I'm pretty conservative, but I recognize that if I want to have the freedom to live my own life, I have to give others the freedom to do the same.

Really, your statements say more about your preconceived notions than anything... I understand cognitive dissonance is difficult to face and overcome, so I fully expect you to attack me more.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

o'bogamol wrote:
@noyb, if you're still reading this thread, I wanted to take the time to let you know how much I appreciate the time you spend patiently explaining your position and experience. As a more or less conservative person, and a religious one, you challenge my assumptions.

As a christian who believes that all people are created by God, how can I view you as anything other than my sibling. And if I view transsexualism as wrong, yet, still how can I judge anyone when I have faults of my own.

If I am unsure how to handle 'gendering' from a religious point of view, then I think that I should err on the side of accepting a person as a sibling rather than worrying about whether my own action of gendering a person by their apparent birth gender vs identity is somehow incorrect. It seems that whatever approach allows me to show the most love towards a sibling in Christ is more important than worrying if using a preferred non-cis pronoun is 'being an enabler' Ultimately, it is more important to me that a person feel welcomed by me and my family than it is for me to be 'correct according to doctrine' but make that person feel unwelcome.

Thank you.

I hope one day we can meet and I hope that I show you the best welcoming that I can, damn the specifics.

Til we meet in person, see ya later sis.
:)


...and this is why I bother to reply to the trans related posts here. Thanks for treating me like a human and for proving my time wasn't a complete waste. My goal is to show others that trans people are actually people, just like you or Naib or anyone else that replied here, and not the simple stereotype/caricature created by the most vocal activists and the people on the other side that intentionally seek to diminish the humanity of trans people.

I was born with a birth defect... and I fixed it. Some people have a problem with that, most likely because it forces them to confront ideas they'd rather continue to pretend didn't exist... but if someone has a cleft palate or type 1 diabetes, we wouldn't tell them to just live with it, we'd encourage them to fix it with the best options modern medicine can offer. Even if someone believes that transitioning is pure evil, my transition hurt nobody but "myself."

Ultimately, the issue with trans people comes down to internalized homophobia... people get so worried they're going to be attracted to someone that "was a dude" (again, lets face it, nobody is freaking out about trans guys that "used to be a woman"), that they need to condemn trans women in a misguided attempt to defend their own "honor," and that's what gets trans people mocked, derided, and killed.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ulenrich wrote:
A take against taking hormons:
Abigail Shrier wrote:
Until just a few years ago, gender dysphoria—severe discomfort in one’s biological sex—was vanishingly rare. It was typically found in less than .01 percent of the population, emerged in early childhood, and afflicted males almost exclusively.

But today whole groups of female friends in colleges, high schools, and even middle schools across the country are coming out as “transgender.” These are girls who had never experienced any discomfort in their biological sex until they heard a coming-out story from a speaker at a school assembly or discovered the internet community of trans “influencers.”

Unsuspecting parents are awakening to find their daughters in thrall to hip trans YouTube stars and “gender-affirming” educators and therapists who push life-changing interventions on young girls—including medically unnecessary double mastectomies and puberty blockers that can cause permanent infertility.
Shrier talks with Joe Rogan


There's a severe problem with children, particularly girls, being convinced they're trans and must undergo medical treatment if they're anything less than a stereotypical person of their assigned gender... a lot of it comes down to girls that are tomboys and girls that are lesbians, both of whom defying traditional adult female social roles, and the push to be so "accepting" that therapists force them down a road they never wanted to go down. There's a huge difference between "girls are hot!" or "I hate dresses and like to work on cars" and "I am a boy, I've felt like a boy since I was 4, and it is so persistent and pervasive that I'm going to physically harm myself if I'm forced to by others to be a girl."

Getting back to my earlier posts in this thread, it's why I specifically identify as transsexual and not transgender. I was so dysphoric that I felt the need to modify my body to the greatest extent medicine is capable of right now, so that I can feel like myself, and I've felt that way since I was 3 (in an era when none of this stuff was talked about publicly anywhere) and first began to self harm when I was around 8 because of it. I have nothing in common with a cross dresser, and unlike the non-binary activist types that do nothing to medically transition, I do believe that gender dysphoria is the defining criteria between someone actually being transsexual and someone that just wants to use the existence of transsexuals as an excuse to be an edgy and confrontational. I can tell you that my local LGBT advocacy group sends out a drag queen to speak to students and doctors about transsexualism, even though "she" has never been in a doctor's office as a trans patient, hasn't undergone any type of medical transition including HRT, and lives/works full time as a man at a day job, but she claims to be transsexual anyway and makes enough money off her speaking fees that she's attempting to make it her full time job.

I watched a JRE video with Debra Soh a couple months ago and I remember agreeing with her quite a bit until she got to the point where she was basically like "I'm not attacking the idea that trans people exist, but I'm going to try to invalidate the entire idea that trans people exist." I don't have time to watch the one with Abigail Shrier right now.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tl;dr
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