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So UK, what's this #KnifeFree campaign about?
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Jaglover
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
Jaglover wrote:
Good try, but lefties are immune to reason.


I'm a lefty myself. I just despise authoritarianism and forcing good people to be walked all over by bad actors.


Unless you believe mankind is in control of its fate and prosperity level can be raised using government regulation you are not true lefty.
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pjp
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bammbamm808 wrote:
Yeah, cause running away from bad people causes them reevaluate their lives and turn over a new leaf. If such folks move into what has long been my environs, best.to abandon my home and neighbors(wishing them luck, of course).
Have you not seen any of the reports of squatters having more rights than legal owners?
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Jaglover
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 2:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://voiceofeurope.com/2017/10/croatian-migrant-leaves-unsafe-sweden-now-lives-happy-poland/

Didn't take long for so called Eastern Europe to recover from socialism. Their advantage is they remember it and they won't let it to poison their country.
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Marcih
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jaglover wrote:
Didn't take long for so called Eastern Europe to recover from socialism. Their advantage is they remember it and they won't let it to poison their country.

++

Signed, an "Eastern" European.
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juniper
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

flysideways wrote:
juniper wrote:
flysideways wrote:
Huh? How did you get there?


if it's easy to get a gun, how do you propose keeping it out of bad people's hands?


By keeping them, bad people, locked up?


You have the most locked up society in the west (and east I think). How is that working?
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Well, every group has its nutjobs, and the Second Amendment crowd is no exception.
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juniper
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
Jaglover wrote:
Good try, but lefties are immune to reason.


I'm a lefty myself. I just despise authoritarianism and forcing good people to be walked all over by bad actors.


the point, of course, of gun laws isn't to prevent only the good from not having guns. It's to prevent everyone from not having them.

The odds of someone robbing me with a gun are tiny. That's because most bad people don't have guns here
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Well, every group has its nutjobs, and the Second Amendment crowd is no exception.
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Ant P.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What a sham, it's been over a fortnight and I still haven't received my free knife. How do they expect me to afford these bloody bus fares if I can't even extract and sell my own organs?
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flysideways
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
the point, of course, of gun laws isn't to prevent only the good from not having guns. It's to prevent everyone from not having them.

I don't think that says what you are intending it to.
juniper wrote:
The odds of someone robbing me with a gun are tiny. That's because most bad people don't have guns here

Most don't?
juniper wrote:
You have the most locked up society in the west (and east I think). How is that working?

After you remove the criminal aliens and non-violent from the number, they still have missed a few.
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aidanjt
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
the point, of course, of gun laws isn't to prevent only the good from not having guns. It's to prevent everyone from not having them.

The odds of someone robbing me with a gun are tiny. That's because most bad people don't have guns here

Criminals don't use legal guns even if they're legal to own, either way, they buy from the black market. And most doesn't mean all. Like I said, criminals, by definition, don't obey the law. And of course that's not going to help you if they pull out a deadly knife of some kind, which is way more likely in either case. Now they're talking about banning yet more 'assault knives' which is retarded, any sharp kitchen knife is a deadly weapon.
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you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault.
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juniper
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
Criminals don't use legal guns even if they're legal to own, either way, they buy from the black market. And most doesn't mean all. Like I said, criminals, by definition, don't obey the law. And of course that's not going to help you if they pull out a deadly knife of some kind, which is way more likely in either case. Now they're talking about banning yet more 'assault knives' which is retarded, any sharp kitchen knife is a deadly weapon.


indisputable. So, surely it matters how many guns are available on the both the real market and the black market. In america, it's near infinite. Here, it is just much harder to get a gun.

there is another length in this spiral. Of course perps here don't get guns because they know their victims don't have guns. you'd have to be insane or desperate to rob a place in the US without a gun.

Simple incentives and markets.
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Well, every group has its nutjobs, and the Second Amendment crowd is no exception.
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flysideways
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
aidanjt wrote:
Criminals don't use legal guns even if they're legal to own, either way, they buy from the black market. And most doesn't mean all. Like I said, criminals, by definition, don't obey the law. And of course that's not going to help you if they pull out a deadly knife of some kind, which is way more likely in either case. Now they're talking about banning yet more 'assault knives' which is retarded, any sharp kitchen knife is a deadly weapon.


indisputable. So, surely it matters how many guns are available on the both the real market and the black market. In america, it's near infinite. Here, it is just much harder to get a gun.

there is another length in this spiral. Of course perps here don't get guns because they know their victims don't have guns. you'd have to be insane or desperate to rob a place in the US without a gun.

Simple incentives and markets.


CCTV shows ruthless robbers threaten shop staff in south east London with a sawn-off shotgun
Quote:
Brown approached the post office counter and threatened staff with a handgun.


It goes without saying that we wish no one were out and about, robbing ...
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juniper
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yup. did someone say it never happens here?
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Well, every group has its nutjobs, and the Second Amendment crowd is no exception.
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flysideways
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
yup. did someone say it never happens here?


juniper wrote:
... Of course perps here don't get guns because they know their victims don't have guns. ...
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wswartzendruber
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
there is another length in this spiral. Of course perps here don't get guns because they know their victims don't have guns. you'd have to be insane or desperate to rob a place in the US without a gun.

Simple incentives and markets.

Places here with permissive carry tend to have low amounts of crime. You'd be insane to try to hold someone up when you can get your face blasted for it.

Simple incentives and markets.
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juniper
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

flysideways wrote:
juniper wrote:
yup. did someone say it never happens here?


juniper wrote:
... Of course perps here don't get guns because they know their victims don't have guns. ...


are you really interpreting that as me saying it never happens here? I read the news daily. it happened the other day.

Quote:
Places here with permissive carry tend to have low amounts of crime. You'd be insane to try to hold someone up when you can get your face blasted for it.


or you go with a bigger gun.
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wswartzendruber
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
or you go with a bigger gun.

That just doesn't seem to be case here.

And...what would a bigger gun do, anyway?
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wswartzendruber wrote:
And...what would a bigger gun do, anyway?

Lead to ICBM exchanges, obviously...
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juniper wrote:
you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wswartzendruber wrote:
juniper wrote:
there is another length in this spiral. Of course perps here don't get guns because they know their victims don't have guns. you'd have to be insane or desperate to rob a place in the US without a gun.

Simple incentives and markets.

Places here with permissive carry tend to have low amounts of crime. You'd be insane to try to hold someone up when you can get your face blasted for it.

Simple incentives and markets.
Just wondering, where are these permissive carry places? Are they state-wide in some places? Are whole cities covered?
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
wswartzendruber wrote:
And...what would a bigger gun do, anyway?

Lead to ICBM exchanges, obviously...
And under the 46th amendment of a useless piece of paper I have the right to use it against any child who may or may not be running in the wrong direction!!!!!!!!!!!!
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
or you go with a bigger gun.

No offense, but that statement just highlights your ignorance where it comes to firearms.
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wswartzendruber
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cokey wrote:
Just wondering, where are these permissive carry places? Are they state-wide in some places? Are whole cities covered?

The entire State of Idaho is a permissive carry zone. Subordinate governments (counties, cities, etc.) are strictly prohibited from enacting any regulations on the matter. K-12 schools are still off limits and carry on a college campus requires the "Enchanced Permit." Federal buildings are still off limits as the State of Idaho does not have the authority to permit carry there.

See ISC 18-3302J for more information.

There are other states who operate in a similar manner.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Old School wrote:
juniper wrote:
or you go with a bigger gun.

No offense, but that statement just highlights your ignorance where it comes to firearms.


none taken.

I of course didn't literally mean a bigger gun. But you'd go for a better one. you don't take a knife to a school shooting, and you also take more than a handgun.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
I of course didn't literally mean a bigger gun. But you'd go for a better one. you don't take a knife to a school shooting, and you also take more than a handgun.

We were talking about hold-ups, not school shootings. One is much more common than the other. And in the one, using a rifle is impractical. For one, I'm going to see you from a mile away actually brandishing a loaded weapon.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wasn't talking about school shootings either (that wasn't the important part of my point).

Stats on idaho (2015):

gun ownership: high
homicide rate: 1.8 (per 100,000, low by american standards)
police kill rate: 7 in total (pop: 1.7mil)

Stats London (2015):

gun ownership: low
homicide rate: 1.4 (normal by uk standards)
police kill rate: 2 total (pop: 8+ mil)

Stats UK (2015):

gun ownership: low
homicide rate: 1
police kill rate: 3 in total (pop 60+ mil)

I am not trying to say that low firearm ownership leads to low homicide rate. Just that your "low" homicide rate isn't actually that low. It's only low by american standards.

2017 is shaping up to be a crazy year. I think we have passed last years homicide total already. We'll see how big the count is in the end.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jaglover wrote:

Didn't take long for so called Eastern Europe to recover from socialism. Their advantage is they remember it and they won't let it to poison their country.


Oh, no! Now it will just fall apart! What about the calif.ate of Stockholm!!
I saw this bright future, us in a unified solution..now it's just poof! Gone!!
Oh, wait. We have doomsayers in the leads saying things are going my way. Yay....
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